1191 replies to this topic

[Mxpro32]

and I have to say, its not overwhelming like it was before, but its pretty bad and its scary to think how I would handle it if I wasn't self employed and able to ride the waves on mostly my own terms.  this morning I woke up anxious and depressed.  I hate feeling emotionally fragile like I can't count on myself.  like the only reason I'm holding it together is because my life is good and easy right now.  every time it goes from good to bad unexpectedly, I keep hearing my psych docs words "most likely you will be on meds the rest of your life".  things are still getting better. they really are, its just tough knowing at any time I can go from everything's fine to freaking out or depressed.  is it normal to still be dealing with this after 18 months?

[fishinghat]

I would say that most are fairly close to normal (but not 100%) by the 18 month stage BUT ... around 5 to 10% have taken around 24 months and maybe 2 or 3 percent take 4 to 5 years. The research says that it takes around 2 years for nerves to recover from benzo withdrawal and if that is true of Cymbalta as well then I would still expect to see some improvements over the next six months. Don't panic yet.

[frog]

mxpro I've been off about as long as you. Truly what you are describing with the out of the blue emotional outbursts and sudden waves of panic sounds all too familiar. I know I sound like a broken record but I think your stress level is still too high, or rather your body is percieving it as too high even if you consciously don't feel like you're all that stressed. Your mind is perceiving stress so it's keeping you in a fight or flighty mode. I believe if you can find ways to signal to your body that you are relaxed and everything is ok, the emotional bits will calm down some more. It may not be a cureall but I think it will help. For me personally L-theanine together with setting aside time in the day to do some deep slow belly breathing have made a huge difference. I still notice tension start to build here and there but I feel like I have better tools to cut it off before it builds to a breaking point. Other people like other supplements and/or meditation, yoga etc. I think you just need to find the method that works for you to signal to your body/mind that you are relaxed and the rest will follow. I no longer count good days or bad days. They are all just days now.

 

With that said, the one thing I cannot figure out is sleep. OMG it makes me crazy

 

I was doing much better at one point, sleeping 7-8 hours. And then a few months ago my sleep got worse again and I'm often waking up around 5 am (very early for me) and overall feeling like I barely slept/dragging every day. Making an appt with my primary care doctor to see if she has any advice. Waking up every morning feeling hungover is no way to live. 

[fishinghat]

Great advice from frog, as usual.

[Mxpro32]

mxpro I've been off about as long as you. Truly what you are describing with the out of the blue emotional outbursts and sudden waves of panic sounds all too familiar. I know I sound like a broken record but I think your stress level is still too high, or rather your body is percieving it as too high even if you consciously don't feel like you're all that stressed. Your mind is perceiving stress so it's keeping you in a fight or flighty mode. I believe if you can find ways to signal to your body that you are relaxed and everything is ok, the emotional bits will calm down some more. It may not be a cureall but I think it will help. For me personally L-theanine together with setting aside time in the day to do some deep slow belly breathing have made a huge difference. I still notice tension start to build here and there but I feel like I have better tools to cut it off before it builds to a breaking point. Other people like other supplements and/or meditation, yoga etc. I think you just need to find the method that works for you to signal to your body/mind that you are relaxed and the rest will follow. I no longer count good days or bad days. They are all just days now.

 

With that said, the one thing I cannot figure out is sleep. OMG it makes me crazy

 

I was doing much better at one point, sleeping 7-8 hours. And then a few months ago my sleep got worse again and I'm often waking up around 5 am (very early for me) and overall feeling like I barely slept/dragging every day. Making an appt with my primary care doctor to see if she has any advice. Waking up every morning feeling hungover is no way to live. 

 

I just feel fragile.  most of my stress stems from that.  I feel like I'm barely keeping it together when times are good, so I freak out at any thought of adversity.  I've lost faith and confidence in myself and my ability to cope because my state of being feels completely out of my control.  lately I've returned to zero motivation, and a really uncomfortable feeling where I can't stand doing anything OR nothing.  humanity feels foreign like I can't access what it is a person is supposed to feel, want, or do at any given moment.  I can't think of anything that would motivate me except fear of losing everything, and that doesn't feel sustainable.  Heres where I think the world being terrible and surreal isn't helping me to ground myself.  I'm trying to find my internal bearings and sort out normal from the chaos while the world doesn't resemble normal and is in chaos.  I feel like I am incapable of functioning like a normal person so I'm doomed to failure.  I can't picture a future, other than a host of calamities that might befall me. the volatility of my emotional and mental state is shocking.  its making me feel like a crazy person, and I'm not a crazy person.  I get windows of feeling normal and everything snaps into focus and life seems so effortless.  my problems all seem manageable and I feel like I have the ability to handle them.  I start getting my hopes up, then all the confusion, anxiety and depression come back, shattering my confidence.  

 

my sleep is still terrible, which makes everything so much worse.  I just feel like crying.  the sleep makes me think its still withdrawals, even though its been so long its getting harder for me to believe its still withdrawals.  I've never had issues sleeping, especially waking up wide awake and not being able to go back to sleep.  

[Mxpro32]

my emotions feel hyper reactive.  its exhausting.  a stressful thought gives shooting anxiety, a sad thought makes me really sad, I get angry easily too.  

[frog]

That all sounds truly challenging and I'm so sorry that you're still dealing with so much. Some of it I can relate to and other parts are unique. The lack of motivation to do anything (emotional exhaustion) but feeling uncomfortable doing nothing (feeling antsy and anxious) sounds familiar and happened to me often when I was feeling tense and on edge. I would get emotionally overwhelmed and agitated looking around our apt and seeing things misplaced or "messy" etc. The feeling would build and build and build until I forced myself to do even one cleaning chore that would give me relief, like opening a bottle of fizzy water. 

 

You're not crazy and you're completely capable of functioning, even if it's not today in this moment. It will come. But I understand the fear you're describing, like you can't be relied upon because you don't know which day you'll wake up feeling capable and which day you won't. Months ago when I was experiencing the same kind of emotional instability I felt so broken because I didn't feel capable of handling anything independently. I felt deeply reliant on my husband to keep our lives moving along, cooking, shopping, dealing with any life problem big and small. I would literally freak myself out by wondering what if my husband left me or died? I would be screwed. We talked about moving to a new apartment and that made me feel awful because I assumed my husband would need to handle the entire process: finding a place, seeing a place, packing, hiring movers, etc etc etc. Maybe I could help, maybe I couldn't. If anything stressful was happening I could barely breathe which made me nonfunctional. It all felt overwhelming and like I wasn't up to the challenge and never would be again. I felt like a child. 

 

Things have changed though. We are moving next week and I actually played a huge role in the entire process. I felt like I was really in control and able to stand on my own two feet. I believe in you that things will not always be how they are today. There will come a point where you look back on this time and say wow I can't believe I was so certain that things would stay this way forever. Everything is so different now. 

 

You are believing in your own anxious, negative self talk. That everything you're feeling and going through now is not temporary, it's forever. I did the same thing. But it's not true. Things change all the time. But you do deserve a break in the cycle so you can start to see that and believe it more clearly. I wish I knew exactly what you could take or do that would give you that Unfortunately I can only suggest what worked for me

[Mxpro32]

That all sounds truly challenging and I'm so sorry that you're still dealing with so much. Some of it I can relate to and other parts are unique. The lack of motivation to do anything (emotional exhaustion) but feeling uncomfortable doing nothing (feeling antsy and anxious) sounds familiar and happened to me often when I was feeling tense and on edge. I would get emotionally overwhelmed and agitated looking around our apt and seeing things misplaced or "messy" etc. The feeling would build and build and build until I forced myself to do even one cleaning chore that would give me relief, like opening a bottle of fizzy water. 

 

You're not crazy and you're completely capable of functioning, even if it's not today in this moment. It will come. But I understand the fear you're describing, like you can't be relied upon because you don't know which day you'll wake up feeling capable and which day you won't. Months ago when I was experiencing the same kind of emotional instability I felt so broken because I didn't feel capable of handling anything independently. I felt deeply reliant on my husband to keep our lives moving along, cooking, shopping, dealing with any life problem big and small. I would literally freak myself out by wondering what if my husband left me or died? I would be screwed. We talked about moving to a new apartment and that made me feel awful because I assumed my husband would need to handle the entire process: finding a place, seeing a place, packing, hiring movers, etc etc etc. Maybe I could help, maybe I couldn't. If anything stressful was happening I could barely breathe which made me nonfunctional. It all felt overwhelming and like I wasn't up to the challenge and never would be again. I felt like a child. 

 

Things have changed though. We are moving next week and I actually played a huge role in the entire process. I felt like I was really in control and able to stand on my own two feet. I believe in you that things will not always be how they are today. There will come a point where you look back on this time and say wow I can't believe I was so certain that things would stay this way forever. Everything is so different now. 

 

You are believing in your own anxious, negative self talk. That everything you're feeling and going through now is not temporary, it's forever. I did the same thing. But it's not true. Things change all the time. But you do deserve a break in the cycle so you can start to see that and believe it more clearly. I wish I knew exactly what you could take or do that would give you that Unfortunately I can only suggest what worked for me

thanks frog.  that was really helpful.  I have had decent stretches where the clouds cleared and I could see things clearly and in context and life felt enjoyable and my troubles seemed manageable.  I think its normal to get discouraged with setbacks.  I was doing so well I kinda thought these days were behind me, then I got sucked down the vortex again and it shattered my confidence.  it makes you feel like the bad times can jump up and grab you at any time. I have the same fears about losing my wife, or mostly losing my business and having to rely on myself to get a job and function fully when I don't trust my ability to do so.  im actually kind of amazed I've been able to successfully run my business for a year and a half.  I'm also pretty proud that I never gave up and went back on meds.  every time I have a big setback I consider it, but ultimately decide I have been through way too much and i'm way to invested in seeing this through so I decide against it.  I feel like I would ultimately regret going back on meds and being numbed out, even if being numb sounds great in comparison at times.  I have to think the dial on my emotional reactivity and fight or flight response will continue to dial down with time.  I'm still in a heightened state of alert like a disaster is happening most of the time. 

 

I'm trying really hard not to focus on my lack of sleep or make a big deal about it, but its really hard when you string together some terrible nights and you start feeling drained physically and emotionally.  I end up feeling like I want to cry all the time when sleep gets bad.  lately its 4 1/2 hours and thats it.  I'm not even waking with anxiety, just popping awake.  my baseline anxiety is still way too high though, so I'm sure that has something to do with it.  I'm trying to focus on that good stretch I had where the anxiety was almost gone for inspiration. 

 

it is tough having 2 kids and a baby with the two older kids barely being in school.  it feels like somebody wants something from me at all times and I usually don't have much to give.  its made worse by the fact that they are always here and I have no alone time to process and unwind.  I really think it hasn't helped to try and get grounded and find normalcy when the world is anything but normal.  everything feels surreal and gloomy.  I can already feel things starting to turn around and get better again.  I appreciate you guys.   

[frog]

The last bit about your children actually really puts things into perspective. It's really no wonder that you feel stressed all the time. You probably ARE stressed and tense all the time because there is a constant demand on your time, energy and emotions. I think when your kids go back to school you will find some balance again. 

 

And I think you made a really beautiful point about maintain perspective that while you don't always give yourself credit, you DID run your business this whole time and you did so exactly the way you are now and even worse. You are capable. It may not be easy but you can do whatever you need to do. 

 

Things will get better over this year as life returns to normal. The more we can tire out our brains through social interactions and new experiences again, the more relaxed we will feel I suspect. I think sleep will come easier too. 

[invalidusername]

I was getting a lot of those waves of anxiety/emotion before I started taking l-theanine. I think it's actually a wave of panic as opposed to your run of the mill "anxiety". Kind of like a mini panic attack. What would happen was I would have some passing anxious thought and because I was already so tense and fight or flighty all the time, instead of letting the thought wander on by, my brain would grab the thought and manifest it physically. Just curious if you ever start paying attention and notice that you're actually super tense or holding your breath in, etc. I definitely catch myself all the time. 

 

Since I started taking l theanine I pretty much don't get the panic waves anymore at all though I am still very tense. Focusing more on my breathing is providing an additional layer of relaxation and tension release though. This is a new thing I'm trying. My theory is that if I can get my body back down to neutral (in terms of stress level) and stay there for a little while then I can hit the 'reset' button on all of this. It's almost like the Cymbalta withdrawal caused such an intense and prolonged stress response that even though the withdrawal has passed, my body thinks that this is my base line now. But if it got wired in, then it can get wired out. That's my goal. 

 

That is a cracking post Frog. Can really relate to it. And for sure - if it gets wired in, it can be wired out. Neuroplasticity tells us all we need to know. It can. Cymbalta really did a number on my stress levels and after more than 2 years later off the damn stuff and I am still getting that baseline back to where it should be, but then again, there is a lot going on in my life which adds to that stress.

 

You have got such a level head on your shoulders and I am sure you will get there!

[invalidusername]

Things will get better over this year as life returns to normal. The more we can tire out our brains through social interactions and new experiences again, the more relaxed we will feel I suspect. I think sleep will come easier too. 

 

I love this line - had to read it over a few times. Full of hope - thank you MX.

 

Fully agree with your summary of the other posts over the last couple of days. I was speaking to someone today who told me a little anecdote which I think is quite fitting here.

 

He said whenever there is significant levels of stress going on, he thinks of when I plane is coming down to an emergency stop and the oxygen masks drop from above. Some of us seem to forget what it there right in front of our face which tells us to put our own mask on FIRST and THEN help others. This is the whole stress game. We just find ourselves going about helping others before ourselves all the while realising that we are wearing ourselves our in doing so. We need that initial point of looking after ourselves before we can be of benefit to others.

 

I have been such a victim to that. Far to much work of which I cannot say no to, and dealing with all the medical staff that are supposedly helping my wife, doing the shopping and so on... and when do I stop to do anything for me? I can't remember the last time I did.... I still have things to learn.

 

Wishing you well as we head further and further towards this goal of getting our normal back again.

[frog]

I'm not generally a super positive person. I often struggle with (and this has been made worse by the withdrawal in many ways) with almost having a dueling brain. I have a strong rational side that is able to see things for what they are, and the emotional side which is much more pessimistic, rooted more in fear and anxiety. Many times I can literally experience both at once but often the emotional side is the one my brain thinks is right. The challenge is to not only hear the rational thoughts but to actually believe them. 

 

And of course as allllllways happens when I post here about how much better I'm doing, my sleep has deteriorated over the past month. I've had many nights of waking up at 3am or 5am, even some nights where I really struggled to fall asleep. I'm certain it's stress related: we are in the middle of packing our apartment, about to move this weekend, living among boxes and chaos. At the same time this is a busy and stressful time of year at work. I have a constant feeling like I'm forgetting something or dropping the ball which is making my mind race as my brain tries to juggle all the things it thinks it needs to remember. Working on trying to remedy this feeling and hoping for the stress to go down once the move passes because boy am I tired

[Mxpro32]

I've been thinking about that lately as well.  how my objective rational mind can totally see how good I have it, and see the threats in proper context, but my emotional reaction is still off the charts and disconnected from the rational reality.  its weird how you can know that, but that doesn't help you bridge the gap.  I have periods where my emotions align with my rational view and everything comes into focus and its really nice.  my emotions are like yanking the wheel on a sports car.  the first hint of a stressful thought and my fear and anxiety shoots to 10 before I even know what happened.  I don't have time to even interpret the thought or provide context.   I'm hoping one day it will be back to like steering a ship where my mood isn't hyper reactive.  sometimes I want to feel slightly numbed out from meds.  if this hyper reactivity doesn't settle down eventually I may have to consider a low dose of something.  its exhausting, where I can never really settle into a boring routine.  every day is intense and volatile.  

 

I've noticed lately, my mood and how I feel aren't necessarily aligned.  like yesterday I was "happy" and being really funny and having fun making my family laugh, enjoying my kids, but I also had raging anxiety and didn't feel "good".  other days, I feel really good inside, but I'm actually angry and cranky.  

[fishinghat]

Oh how I remember those days.

[Mxpro32]

Oh how I remember those days.

At least it's past tense for you. Gives me hope, lol

[Mxpro32]

well. I've went from stringing together a good stretch of doing pretty well, only to be shocked again by waking up full of anxiety and fear and being depressed all day.  I don't know why I think its behind me every time.  I put a good week together of feeling pretty good, before that it was hit and miss, but not too bad.  the sleep was actually decent too.  I was sleeping 6 hours straight which has been unheard of.  other nights sleep was more interrupted by I could actually go back to sleep.  last night I woke at 2, then 4, and tossed fitfully with anxiety and never really went back to sleep.  I wasn't thinking or stressing about anything in particular, just struck with fear and anxiety like I was all the time early in withdrawals.  I'm tempted to try a low dose of a regular ssri and see if it helps.  I really hate to do that considering how dedicated I've been to getting off, and all of the misery I've already endured to do so.  I'm wondering if a low dose would at least give me a break for a while and let me get regular sleep.  then one day down the road maybe I can come off of it slowly.  I think the numbing action of the ssri might actually help considering how sensitive and reactive all of my emotions still are.  

[fishinghat]

Mxpro, as an outsider looking in it sure seems like you are still slowly improving. The ssri sounds good but with ssris taking 4 to 6 weeks to kick in I am not sure it is worth it.

[Mxpro32]

has anyone had persistent insomnia for as long as I have?  my sleep is still terrible.  I wake up wide awake early and can't really go back to sleep.  on good days I can sort of drift back to sleep in short bursts, on bad days I wake up in terror and fear and toss and turn in misery.  I'm on a stretch of the terror sleep right now.  I've really been trying not to think about my mental health or obsess about anything so I haven't been coming around, but the sleep with anxiety and terror is wearing me down.  I don't like being a complainer all the time, but I don't know if this is still normal for withdrawal.  I really don't know what to do either way.  all I know is I was never like this before meds.  

[frog]

I have had insomnia for over a year that I've been medicating

I'm seeing a CBT-I specialist right now to hopefully be able to sleep without medication. My understanding from what he's explained is that it's actually very difficult to return to a non-insomnia state after chronic insomnia without putting in the effort. 

 

If you're interested I can give you some of the basic things that he's provided for me, with the caveat that this kind of thing is highly personalized so of course without individualized attention to what is driving your insomnia this may not be enough to help...

 

As you can imagine the foundation is to regulate your sleep/wake cycle to remove that variable. The last and maybe hardest and most important piece is to work on dampening your hyperarousal system which is what's not allowing you to fall asleep/stay asleep. This pretty much supercedes any attempt at sleep hygiene, regulating waking times etc. None of that stuff will work if you're all wired up for any reason. 

 

Basically you want to check in with yourself as you're getting ready for bed/getting into bed and rate yourself on scale of 1-5:

 

1 - very calm mind and relaxed body; peaceful like right before you're drifting off

2 - awake but calm mind (not racing or wandering) body relaxed; a feeling like you're reading a good book and your mind is focused

3 - feeling awake, alert, mind wandering or running; may feel mildly anxious or just fully awake and not sure why

4 - very wide awake and "on alert"; could feel anxious, frustrated, stressed OR you may feel like it's the middle of the day and your mind is on over-drive thinking about everything to do

5 - very wide awake and "activated": may feel like panic, heart racing, your body is "on"

 

the goal is to get check in and progressively work your way down through the levels until you hit level 1. some suggestions for things to do at each level:

 

5 - get out of your bed and out of your bedroom, take a shower, hold some ice if you're really freaking out. all things to completely distract your mind and body away from the panicky thoughts

4 - get out of your bed and out of your bedroom, watch reruns on tv (something mundane like friends or seinfeld nothing stressful); fold some laundry. activities that require focus but are not super active or stressful

3 - sit straight up in bed or get out of bed, read something, listen to guided relaxation exercises

2 - in bed, could do a meditation focusing on your breath, count backwards by 7s, go through the alphabet and name a few animals by letter. give your mind a distracting task 

1 - relax and let sleep come (hopefully)

 

so you work your way down the levels as best as you can. 

 

oh and never look at the clock. when you wake up in the night and don't fall right back asleep don't worry about what time it is just go through the levels again to relax. doc said the goal isn't necessarily to fall back to sleep (putting pressure on falling asleep has the opposite effect) but to get yourself relaxed so that maybe sleep will just come on its own. 

 

not sure if any of that's helpful to you but maybe. Per the doc, sleep is such an innate part of our biology that it's impossible to break that system or forget how to do it. Other stuff just gets in the way and you become too focused on it and put too much pressure on it. For me I feel like sleep used to be so automatic, you don't even think about it happening. And now I'm overthinking it which causes the whole thing to not work. Kind of like when you walk up stairs and suddenly you start thinking about what you're doing and you trip. I guess the advice is to try to stop worrying about your sleep and talking about it

[fishinghat]

Good advice, as usual, from frog. 

 

This is a long shot but it may help. People who go through withdrawals often develop LPR (Laryngopharyngeal Reflux). Now this is not like any other reflux.  It is often called 'silent reflux' as it can exist with little to no symptoms. If there are symptoms it would be clearing the throat often and maybe some sinus drainage. It makes it difficult to sleep, wake often and a lot of bad dreams as well as anxiety. A simple way to find out if this is contributing is to get some Imodium (2 mg loperimide) and take around 1/5 tablet an hour before bed. Now tha amount that people find useful varies but this would be a good average. If this drastically helps sleep then there are other things that can be done to minimize the effect. Loperimide can cause constipation if taken for too long or in full dosage but you don't need to worry about that for a one time 1/5th dose for one night only. May not help but it can't hurt.

[Mxpro32]

Good advice, as usual, from frog. 

 

This is a long shot but it may help. People who go through withdrawals often develop LPR (Laryngopharyngeal Reflux). Now this is not like any other reflux.  It is often called 'silent reflux' as it can exist with little to no symptoms. If there are symptoms it would be clearing the throat often and maybe some sinus drainage. It makes it difficult to sleep, wake often and a lot of bad dreams as well as anxiety. A simple way to find out if this is contributing is to get some Imodium (2 mg loperimide) and take around 1/5 tablet an hour before bed. Now tha amount that people find useful varies but this would be a good average. If this drastically helps sleep then there are other things that can be done to minimize the effect. Loperimide can cause constipation if taken for too long or in full dosage but you don't need to worry about that for a one time 1/5th dose for one night only. May not help but it can't hurt.

thats interesting.  I think I'll try that.  I am constantly coughing to clearing my throat.  I just assumed its because my throat was tight from anxiety.    my wife says I have been snoring terribly, so I have an appointment with an ent for a sleep study.  

 

frog:  thanks for the advice.  I have really been working on not stressing about the sleep too much, and for the most part I'm getting better at it.   its easier when its just insomnia.  when the anxiety and fear terrorize me every time I wake up it makes it harder, but I still try.  I've been toughing everything out pretty good, but eventually I reach a point where I desperately want a break from the struggle and I wallow a little.  I start fearing this is just my life now and it sucks.  every time I consider going on an antidepressant, I'll hit a smooth patch that gives me hope and I don't want to abandon all the work I've put in.  once in a while I'll have a short moment of clarity where I feel actual peace, and it moves me to tears (not that thats hard to do these days).

[frog]

Ooooh snoring could be indicative of a sleep apnea and that could for sure cause you to wake up in a panic.

 

Mayo clinic:

Snoring is often associated with a sleep disorder called obstructive sleep apnea (OSA). Not all snorers have OSA, but if snoring is accompanied by any of the following symptoms, it may be an indication to see a doctor for further evaluation for OSA:

• Witnessed breathing pauses during sleep
• Excessive daytime sleepiness
• Difficulty concentrating
• Morning headaches
• Sore throat upon awakening
• Restless sleep
• Gasping or choking at night
• High blood pressure
• Chest pain at night
• Your snoring is so loud it's disrupting your partner's sleep

[Mxpro32]

I never had issues staying asleep on cymbalta though. 

[frog]

It kind of sounds like you're probably having nighttime panic attacks. Which can be a result of having a lot of day time stress and even though your brain allows you to fall asleep despite it, it continues to process it in the night. I think I would still suggest the best place to start is to establish a longer wind down bedtime routine so you can be as relaxed as possible as you're falling asleep. Meaning avoid things that could trigger your stress, whatever that might be for you. Don't read the news or think about work. Watch peaceful shows or read something  And don't get in bed until you really feel relaxed and ready. Have you tried doing things like that consistently every night? I know from your other posts that stress is a big part of your day so the winddown will be super important. 

 

Cymbalta was dampening your anxiety and stress response, as a consequence I guess your stress didn't keep you awake at night. Some extra effort during the day and evening to manage your anxiety will probably go a long way at letting you sleep more peacefully. 

 

The reason you're probably able to sleep half the night is because the first half of the night your sleep drive is what keeps you asleep. That's basically the sleep energy you build up during the day just by being awake all those hours. It may be that as your sleep drive depletes, the arousal of your brain (anxiety, stress, etc) overcomes the second system that comes in to keep you asleep the rest of the night (sorry I forget the name) and you pop up awake. I think I have a similar problem but in reverse. I'm too alert to even fall asleep in the first place. 

 

Since I take medication every night to sleep it's hard for me to understand how to relax properly for bed since eventually the sedative hits me like a ton of bricks either way. I'm trying to practice now in preparation for trying to get off the Seroquel but I'm pretty nervous it won't work :/

 

Good luck to us both!

[Mxpro32]

It's really strange. Last night I slept 2 hours and woke as if I'd slept a full night. No anxiety at all. Actually felt rested and wide awake ready for the day. Then I eventually went back to sleep for 3 more hours. Can't keep my eyes open today though. I'm trying to do the wind down thing. I actually have good stretches where the anxiety isn't noticeable now, but the insomnia is the same either way. The waking up in terror thing is pretty rare but awful. The stretch of terror culminated in a depressed day yesterday, but the terror was gone last night and I feel much better today. Oh the fun.

[fishinghat]

I take it the Imodium did not help?

[Mxpro32]

I take it the Imodium did not help?

Yeah, no difference

[fishinghat]

Oh well. It was worth a shot.

[invalidusername]

Hi MX, and my apologies on the silence on the subject.

 

I, too, have been where you are now. I remember batting with the decision of whether or not to go to the bathroom as it might wake my further, or just sit in bed and ignore a bladder in need of evacuation in the hopes that I might ignore it and fall asleep again. This went on for some time. The getting to sleep part was rescued with meditation, but it took time and practise. 

 

As for the waking in the night it started changing when I reached the "f**k it" point. Where you just don't care anymore. You throw the towel in and think, well if this is how it is going to be, then lets just get on with it. But it wasn't an attempt to trick the symptoms, underneath not really believing it myself. It was a genuine point where I simply did not care anymore. This was my life. No sooner had that started and my sleep kept coming back. 

 

This is a fight you cannot win.

 

You take meds, you have hopes they will work. When they don't - what happens? It sets you back and kills off a bit more of that hope. You try distraction techniques, they don't work. What happens? Oh yea - more hope gone. And so it goes on. You put stress on yourself to react well to all these things and it is that stress that ends up making things worse for you, just as it did for me. 

 

This may be some very unorthodox advice to do "nothing", but the stress you are putting yourself under by trying all these different solutions appears to only serve to keep you at the same point. 

 

Food for thought anyway...

 

IUN

[Mxpro32]

I'm almost to that point with the sleep. I typically don't give it a lot of thought. I've had a stretch of pretty good depression here that is always discouraging and makes me ponder sleep and wonder if I'm getting better. Most days are wildly fluctuating anxiety, depression, depersonalization, sadness, etc. The fact I'm such a mess tells me my system is still out of sorts, but God it's getting old. I think the depression sets in when I grow tired of dealing with it and start losing hope. It's exhausting.