1191 replies to this topic

[Mxpro32]

well today the depression is much better.  I've been very emotional though.  I feel that upwelling of emotion where I cry or laugh.  I much prefer feeling powerful emotions to depressed emotional pain, but I'm hoping it tones down a bit eventually.  I feel the tiniest bit of well being which is nice.  I'm feeling better about the baby too.  I don't think a precious baby is going to be the thing that ruins my life.  I keep feeling like 40 is too old to have a baby, but mostly I think its making me confront my aging and mortality.  this has been quite the year to come off of meds and deal with withdrawals.  

[invalidusername]

I hope 40 isn't too old!! And Hat for sure will hope 40 isn't too old

 

Glad that you had a better one today. I'm still going along with wherever my days take me. Still very apathetic, but it could be so much worse, and I know it will pass. 3 weeks of overdoing it isn't going to disappear overnight.

[Mxpro32]

well I had a really good couple of days.  best I've had in a long time.  my anxiety is pretty low, and everything seems in perspective and not so scary.  I've even felt ambition and motivation for my business.  I've had a general sense of well being and optimism.  I think this will eventually be my normal and that makes me very happy.  brings tears to my eyes actually.  I'm looking forward to my new son being here, and  I'm not just seeing the negative in everything.  its so nice.  I know this is probably just a window, but hopefully its a window into what is to come.  I have a near perfect life, so its nice to actually feel like it.  

[frog]

YES! 

That's so great to hear

It is at least a window into what is possible! 

I'm ok for the most part. The anxiety waxes and wanes. It still likes to come on randomly as this anxious feeling, frequently no anxious thoughts tied to it. Just this feeling I can't tie to anything and can't resolve either so it just hangs around and drives me nuts and makes me more anxious that it's there. It's easier to deal with the anxiety when there are anxious thoughts. At least I can tell what's driving it and think about it.

This week I've been kind of depressed I guess and just unmotivated by anything and overall feeling glum and unhappy. Everything feels monotonous and like there is nothing to look forward to, which isn't even true. Tomorrow is my birthday and we're having a picnic with some friends in the park. But everything feels dumb and pointless. Can't tell if it's just exhaustion from this pandemic or what. Sigh. 

[Mxpro32]

Happy belated birthday Frog!   i'm still going good.  my sleep is even getting a little better.  I'm sleeping 6 hours before waking up, and I'm usually able to get back to sleep sort of.  life doesn't seem so scary.  I'm seeing all of the opportunities in front of me instead of constant panic and anxiety about all of the things that could potentially go wrong.  I'm enjoying the moment instead of constantly worrying about the future.  I'm still getting anxiety, but but I'm not depressed and my motivation is back, so its not slowing me down or dominating me.  the pandemic is taking its toll on everyone.  normality is gone and there isn't a lot to look forward to.  my kids are still doing online school which is a disaster for them and us.  its hard to get anything done when half the day is used up playing teacher.  everyone is always home and on top of each other so every day bleeds into the next so the weekends don't feel special.  every day is the same.  I'm over it. 

[invalidusername]

WONDERFUL MX!!! 

 

As Frog said - window or otherwise, this shows you that your brain is capable of showing you a good time!! Isn't it wonderful when you can see those things starting to come back?! Difficult to see, but now that you have seen these instances, you know they are possible and these are what you need to hold on to when and if you slip a little.

 

I'm trying my best not to think about the whole pandemic thing. It has got way out of hand and it has impacted far too much for my liking, but the world is in it together, but I just feel like the world is a school and the powers that be just won't let us out to play in the field!!

 

*IUN stamps his feet in a girly fit of rage*

 

HAPPY BIRTHDAY FROG!!

 

21 again isn't it?! I really hope that despite the above that you had a good day.

 

You are right about the anxiety - when you can pin it to something, it feels like it is justified and you can reason with it a bit more. The issue I have had with my depression has been just that - whilst there have been issues, I would say nothing that would cause me to get so down and apathetic to have gone on as long as it did. Fortunately the light at the end of the tunnel was sunshine and not a train coming the other way and I am kinda out of it.

 

But for what it is worth, I know the "can't be bothered" as it has been just that for a good week prior to this. So if MX and I can get there, you will do!! Just ride the wave my sweet...

[Mxpro32]

I knew the window was probably going to end, and today it seems like it is.  its so weird.  I couldn't fall or stay asleep and woke up with crampy bowls, which happens every time my mood gets worse.  my mindset has switched from goal oriented to fear and uncertainty.  my optimism has turned to pessimism and dread.  hopefully this doesn't last too long.  its frustrating in that it doesn't feel like its in my control at all.  

[fishinghat]

It isn't in your control Mxpro. It is a chemical reaction that just has to run its course until your body gets it back in control. It does seem like your good spells are lasting longer and your bad spells shorter though. I think the worse part is over.

[invalidusername]

It isn't in your control Mxpro. It is a chemical reaction that just has to run its course until your body gets it back in control.

 

Absolutely.

 

Very difficult, but you need to compassionate towards it as best you can.

[Mxpro32]

I feel like I'm so close, it feels like something I should be able to control.  Its very nice to get glimpses of what my normal can be though.  I'm definitely encouraged by the changes happening.  I no longer feel static.  I think I've been off the klonopin long enough that that is starting to level out.  my anxiety is significantly lower than it was most of the time.  I slept terrible last night and woke up with some restlessness and anxiety, but not the level it was.  I think even the depression is my body getting used to not being so anxious all the time.  I don't feel stuck any more.  

[fishinghat]

That was a very intuitive post Mxpro. Well done. Stay patient.

[frog]

That's awesome Mxpro! It's huge progress. Don't get hung up on days where you wake up and you think oh the window is over. If you're anything like me then things will be changing from one day to the next or sometimes even within the same day. 

 

I think these days I'm ok for the most part but I still can't fall asleep on my own and I'm still very sensitive to preexisting anxieties. There are also still moments where I randomly feel panicky feelings welling up. They don't turn into full blown attacks but they just kind of spin around and make my chest tight and my breathing hard and I start to freak out because I want to make them go away. 

 

I've been using this time to dig into the roots of my anxieties with my therapist. Man it's hard work. I cry every single session without fail. It has just really turned my world view inside out when I started really understanding how much anxiety and tension I've always carried around with me. My brain has always subconsciously been working really hard to make me feel in control of every situation as a way to avoid ever feeling caught "off guard" I think? It's overwhelming too, suddenly I feel like I can see the cage around me and it seems impossible to ever get out of it. Whereas before I somehow didn't notice or care about the cage so it didn't bother me too much. I'm sure even consciously naming all of this is stuff a big step toward moving beyond it, but so far it seems like nothing positive is happening except me feeling like crap after every session LOL

[Mxpro32]

lol.  yeah, I'm working on stuff with a therapist too, but I'm wondering if thats even the issue.  when I had my good patch, everything was easy, and now, everything is hard and the anxious feelings find thoughts to attach to I think.  I know this because a lot of times the thoughts it attaches to are so ridiculous theres no way I'm actually worried about them.  it pretty much seems like when I'm anxious or depressed, the anxious and depressed thoughts are there, and when I'm feeling better, its easy not to think about or worry about those things.  I'm still working on my thoughts and issues, I just don't know how fruitful thats going to be.  my sleep has been absolute garbage again.  I just feel so antsy and restless.  I can't stop tossing and turning.  I can't lay still. 'm not having anxious thoughts or worries.  I just feel antsy, unsettled and anxious.  I'm so tired I just feel like crying.  if it wasn't for the anxiety I would fall asleep in the middle of the day.  I don't think anyone could feel good sleeping like this.  my wife is sleeping bad because she uncomfortable with the pregnancy, and shes getting overwhelmed, emotional, and frazzled.  it just makes everything so hard.  

[Mxpro32]

there goes the theory of my anxiety winding down.  it keeps ramping up and is really getting intense today.  no specific anxious thoughts, just intense anxiety.  oh well.  its the season for that I guess.  It will pass too, I just need to buckle up for a period of crappy sleep.

[frog]

Yeah I feel you. There are definitely occasional days or sometimes stretches of a few days when the anxiety attaches to anything and everything like you said and there's nothing you can do about it and it's terrible. I'll feel restless and jittery and a little panicky all day long and I just feel miserable. I think month 7 of this pandemic is really wearing me down too. Everything feels pointless and monotonous and boring. I'm depressed every day that I have to spend my whole day in 1 room. I'm also so glad that I don't have cable news. Reading the paper and seeing the news on my phone is bad enough. I couldn't deal with the 24 hour election news cycle right now. 

[Mxpro32]

I can feel the anxiety/lack of sleep turning to depression again too. I am so tired of covid, and specifically the lack of a timeline. My local hospital serves 200k people and has 2 covid patients in ICU and my kids still aren't in school. Supposedly we are a hotspot too. They are never going to free us here in California. It feels like this shot is never going to end.

[frog]

Unfortunately limiting people's exposure seems to be the only way to contain this thing, as frustrating as it is. It's hard to contain exposure in a school setting and we're learning that kids might actually be pretty strong spreaders of the disease even if they themselves don't usually get sick. It sounds like your community has been fortunate in not getting a lot of severe cases that require hospitalization which is awesome! But you never know if you or your wife might be that unlucky one, especially not worth the risk to your unborn baby It's sad to read stories of people surviving COVID and continuing to have serious complications. There's still so much we don't know about it and the worst part is we're seeing that immunity wears off quickly even if you had it before. I sleep and work in the same room and it's been really tough on my already fragile mental and emotional state so I totally hear you. COVID fatigue is real! Unfortunately our federal leadership doesn't GAF and thinks people dying 'is what it is' so here we are. 

 

I live in the Bay Area and we were under strict lockdown until a month ago. Now it seems like things are reopening. We've eaten at several restaurants, gone to a museum. I think there's a light at the end of the tunnel

[Mxpro32]

I think we disagree on covid and politics, lol, so I won't go there   

[Mxpro32]

I'm back to all of of my emotions being really powerful and overwhelming.  I was picking up my kids homework packets and saw them handing out meals to less fortunate students and the thought of having trouble feeding my kids made me start crying.  my son did something cute and I was overwhelmed with emotion and started crying.  it manifests as anxiety if I subconsciously make any effort to suppress them.  this is so obviously an effect of withdrawal that its actually somewhat easier to take because I'm not questioning it.  my sleep has gone back to the 4-5 hours and then popping wide awake.  I don't wake with immediate anxiety, but it settles in pretty quickly once I'm awake and makes it impossible to fall back to sleep.  this particular sleep pattern seems to take the biggest toll emotionally.  it feels like its trying to drag me back into depression.  for a bit there I was sleeping anxiously and fitfully, but not popping so wide awake at 4-5 hours.  I guess I get to ride this phase out for a while and hopefully another good phase comes sooner than later.  my counselor seems to think it has nothing to do with withdrawals, which I guess is her job to address everything from that perspective.  she thinks my nighttime anxiety and lack of sleep is due to me stressing about sleeping.  i disagree.  

[invalidusername]

Hey guys...

 

Just catching up with the goings-on here and having a good read.

 

So, MX... what Frog is saying is very true. Anxiety, when it is having it's day, will attach to just about everything. It becomes a filter through which every thought must pass through before it goes to the reasoning part of the brain. And that can just come and go seemingly as it pleases. It is still very difficult for me to read this stuff as I can relate to it so much and I am thinking "Gee, I hope this doesn't happen to me again" - you see! That's the anxiety already kicking off! 

 

It is there. It is a case of learning to live with it rather than it going away. Anxiety is a part of life. No-one is without it. 

 

I went to have my alignment done on my car on Thursday. 20 mile drive and had no choice but to sit in a waiting room for over an hour. I was fine. But there was one point where I got a tiny little pain in my head, and there was a moment of anxiety. I had to break that barrier and say to myself, "what are you doing? It's ok....". I accept that these things will happen, it is just a case of not getting hung up on them.

 

Yours is a very tough situation I know, as it continues to repeat, but you ARE in a very difficult situation which rarely lets up. Having a baby is one of life's bit stresses, up there with getting married, divorced and moving house. Then on top of that you have the business, the kids, caring for the wife. 

 

Compassion is the key. Stop every once in a while during the day and just say to yourself... "Hey, I am doing really well considering everything that is going on". Take some deep breaths. Or do what I have been doing. Get an app that bleeps every hour and stop WHATEVER it is you are doing (except driving!!) and just take 10 deep breaths. It really helps. Not just the breathing, but the ability to stop and not keep pushing yourself.

 

I got to a point where it was going off and I would ignore it, or say (sometimes out loud!) "yes, yes... in a minute". I got to the point of uninstalling it, but I stopped and did a reality check. That's what my anxiety wants!! LOL. 

 

So it is still there and is still my little beeping friend.

 

I hope this is has been something of a help - wishing you all a good weekend.

 

IUN

[Mxpro32]

Hey guys...

 

Just catching up with the goings-on here and having a good read.

 

So, MX... what Frog is saying is very true. Anxiety, when it is having it's day, will attach to just about everything. It becomes a filter through which every thought must pass through before it goes to the reasoning part of the brain. And that can just come and go seemingly as it pleases. It is still very difficult for me to read this stuff as I can relate to it so much and I am thinking "Gee, I hope this doesn't happen to me again" - you see! That's the anxiety already kicking off! 

 

It is there. It is a case of learning to live with it rather than it going away. Anxiety is a part of life. No-one is without it. 

 

I went to have my alignment done on my car on Thursday. 20 mile drive and had no choice but to sit in a waiting room for over an hour. I was fine. But there was one point where I got a tiny little pain in my head, and there was a moment of anxiety. I had to break that barrier and say to myself, "what are you doing? It's ok....". I accept that these things will happen, it is just a case of not getting hung up on them.

 

Yours is a very tough situation I know, as it continues to repeat, but you ARE in a very difficult situation which rarely lets up. Having a baby is one of life's bit stresses, up there with getting married, divorced and moving house. Then on top of that you have the business, the kids, caring for the wife. 

 

Compassion is the key. Stop every once in a while during the day and just say to yourself... "Hey, I am doing really well considering everything that is going on". Take some deep breaths. Or do what I have been doing. Get an app that bleeps every hour and stop WHATEVER it is you are doing (except driving!!) and just take 10 deep breaths. It really helps. Not just the breathing, but the ability to stop and not keep pushing yourself.

 

I got to a point where it was going off and I would ignore it, or say (sometimes out loud!) "yes, yes... in a minute". I got to the point of uninstalling it, but I stopped and did a reality check. That's what my anxiety wants!! LOL. 

 

So it is still there and is still my little beeping friend.

 

I hope this is has been something of a help - wishing you all a good weekend.

 

IUN

 

good advice.  I've been reading the book you recommended and I'm finding it helpful.  some of the advice like pushing forward and keep functioning no matter how bad your anxiety gets is tricky for me.  i'm not sure if that applies to me right now when my nerves are fried, or if I'm just being weak and making excuses.  I'm trying to push through and work a full day, and it almost feels impossible.  I feel so anxious and emotionally overwhelmed.  I just feel like crying.  my emotions over the weekend were very powerful and sensitive, but its manageable when nothing is expected of me.  so I'm not sure if its best to push through my anxiety, or just be patient.  despite the lack of sleep and strong emotions and anxiety I haven't really gotten depressed again.  I feel like when I push myself in the shop it starts heading that way though.  I have no will power and everything feels overwhelming.   

[invalidusername]

I think the pushing through part needs to be judged on the circumstances. If you have gone through a lot and things are on a tricky balance, then you need to give yourself time out. What he is saying is that if you are faced with a situation where you would otherwise feel safe and good to do something, don't let the anxiety stop you. But if you have other circumstances that are compounding the anxiety, then I think you need to weigh up the options. 

 

For example, I am suffering severe fatigue at the moment, and although I am still working, I am not putting myself in situations to keep my anxiety tested. For example, I need to get to the bank to drop some cash off which involves parking in the city centre and walking a fair bit through crowds of people, then standing in line for an unknown time at the bank etc. Wouldn't normally be a problem for me, but because I am very bad physically and have no idea what might happen, doing something like that at the moment I feel is not a good idea because I am already starting the anxiety meter half full, if you get what I mean.

 

When I was in the throes of my worst anxiety, it was predominantly my health that triggered it, so if I am ill, for whatever reason, I back off anything that might ramp up anxiety.

[Mxpro32]

I'm starting to have more windows where all the baggage lifts and I see things clearly.  when I'm in those windows, I can handle everything and deal easily with things that would otherwise be overwhelming.  that tells me its not really an issue that needs to be pushed through.  I'm working on just getting better and I think everything else will iron itself out.  my down dips aren't lasting as long either.  I've had a couple days with crazy strong anxiety, but I'm getting better at not adding worry on top of it and continue functioning to a degree.  I liked his snippet on sleep, how he stopped stressing about it at all, even going as far as ignoring the sleep hygiene recommendations.  just truly act like its not a big deal to be stressed over.  I think the tricky part about all of this is that its part chemistry from withdrawals, and part thoughts and things to be worked through.  I think the withdrawals make my nerves and emotions way stronger and more excitable, so my thoughts have a much bigger impact than they should.  I'm in that mode lately, where I feel like there is actually something to work on.  my thoughts and emotions effect everything.  then there are times where it feels 100% out of my control.  I'm just persistently depressed or anxious or both and nothing I think about or do makes any difference.  I'm grateful that things seem to be moving again.  my emotions are really strong, and anxiety is strong and comes and goes, and depression comes and goes  and I have periods where things are really good, because it feels like my mind is working on things and something is happening in my healing.  the long stretch of consistent anxiety and depression was making me worry that I was stuck like that.  

[Mxpro32]

hey guys.  I've been gone for a while because I've been managing pretty well and trying no to think about it too much.  things are still going fairly well with bumps in the road.  I've had periods of feeling pretty normal.  I've been working mostly full days for a while, which is a big deal as I couldn't handle that before.  the last couple of days, my creativity and drive even came back.  I'm actually motivated to design products and grow my business.  yesterday evening I went from feeling great, like everything made sense and I was normal, then I started feeling overwhelmingly emotional all of a sudden and now I'm pretty depressed today.  I haven't been depressed like this in a long time.  just when I think maybe things make sense and I'm in control, things just swoop in for no reason and screw me up.  overall things are going in the right direction, but its really frustrating to be derailed still.  

[frog]

Hello!

I was just thinking you hadn't been around for almost two months and I assumed it was because things were going much better.

That's really awesome to hear. I hope that gives you the confidence that everything is moving in the right direction. Bumps in the road are exactly that. It'll pass, but I think the reality here is that we're never really in control whether it's withdrawal or not. Our bodies just kind of do their own thing and we just have to roll with it (very hard to do especially if your anxiety triggers are situations that are not in your control like mine LOL) Meditation is supposed to help with this though I've been so lazy about doing it lately sigh. 

 

In any case, it'll pass! And then probably come back again, and then pass again and so on. I also think the slowness of life during COVID has allowed for a lot more self reflection for better or worse. Like there's less distractions and more time to dwell on things. As interesting as it's been to get more in touch with my anxious inner self though, I'm really looking forward to having a lot more distraction in my life again I have to say.

 

Next week we're driving to LA to have Thanksgiving dinner with my husband's brother. It's a 6 hr drive which is the longest travel I've done since the Cymbalta crash a year ago. I'm so much better now that I don't feel like there's any reason to be nervous about it but I still am. But this'll bring me one step closer to feeling comfortable with traveling farther away on planes to see my family or one to day to finally go to Japan for our very belated honeymoon And I'm very excited about that!

[invalidusername]

Hey MX...

 

The derailing is the toughest part, but it is par for the course. As difficult as it is, this occurs. Ironically, I am feeling it today, but this is because I have severely overdone it for the whole week, coupled with the fact that the wife has been having no-end of issues with her medication and being pushed and pulled between the doctor and the mental health department with no-one willing to take responsibility. So it has been left to me to deal with and have an anxious presence 24/7.

 

But as Frog said, it will pass, and probably come back again. But the trick is to as best as you can, give it no mind. It is SO SO difficult when you have had such a long stretch of good moments, but chemicals are like this and are a real pain. There often seems to be no rhyme or reason. But stressing about it will only make it worse and lengthen the process. 

 

I have been just over a year now without any seriously on-going issues, and I am still concerned about something coming back! It is forever a work in progress. I know mine is not helped with the wife as it is a constant reminder, but we also need to remember that EVERYONE. The man on the street out for a walk with his dog, the girl in the apartment upstairs... they all have these moments. Life is never straightforward or linear. We so easily get stuck in a mindset that we are only better when we never have a bad day, but in reality this is not the case!!

[fishinghat]

"We so easily get stuck in a mindset that we are only better when we never have a bad day, but in reality this is not the case!!"

 

Somebody put that saying in a frame and hang it on the wall!!!

[Mxpro32]

I feel like my progress is getting faster lately.  I had a really stressful anxious week because a competitor came out with a really nice product for a really cheap price.  that's basically my nightmare scenario for triggering anxiety, and while it wasn't fun, I imagine it wasn't much worse than the average person facing a major threat to their business.  I had some sleepless nights and such, but Im handling it pretty well.  I got my thinking cap on and started designing and developing my own products and I'm able to do so really well.  I feel like I'm rising to the challenge and building confidence.  at this point, my anxiety is pretty much gone and I'm functioning well.  I'm sleeping much better for the most part, and I'm no longer waking with a nightmarish terror like I used to every morning.  I even wake with a sense of well being a lot of the time.  a sense of well being is much more common during the day now as well.  I was just pushing through before and doing everything that needed to be done, but the anxiety was intense and I almost never felt content or good.  the doctor thinks my new baby boy is going to be here in the next week or two.  my wife is 36 weeks, so it wouldn't be too early and he should be plenty healthy.  I'm feeling really good about that now too.  I'm looking forward to meeting him.  I still get really emotional easily.  I cried when alex trebek died, my sister in law made me a pecan pie for thanksgiving and I cried that someone thought of me to bake a pie.  I cry when I think of my new boy on the way.  I cried watching the guy from flip or flop on hgtv propose to his girlfriend, lol.  I'll take it though.  its really nice to feel emotions.  

[fishinghat]

Man, that is sooooo wonderful Mxpro. I hadn't heard anything from you recently so I was hoping you had turned the corner. There is still improvements to come but at least you are fairly comfortable.  A job well done Sir.

[frog]

This is so fantastic I just had a feeling that things would turn out ok

I was also RARELY moved to tears by anything in the preceding 33 years. But now the cheesiest stuff in movies or shows brings on the waterworks, I watched a Pixar short about a cartoon dog and kitten in which the dog was being abused and the kitten helped him escape and they were adopted by a nice family. It was maybe 10 mins long. I bawled like a baby. It's a little annoying to be honest because it comes on so intensely but definitely not the worst part of all of this. 

 

I wrote about this on my own thread but I'm still struggling in some ways. For me personally I don't think it's necessarily a question of withdrawal at this point. I think it's just been a year of tremendous change, upheaval and stress in my life in general, the pandemic of course making all of that more intense and more drawn out. We moved across the country far away from friends and family, my husband lost his job a year ago just as I was starting a new one so I've been the single income while living in one of the most expensive cities in the US. We're very fortunate to have a safety net but it's still a lot of pressure and my company has been wildly unstable the past 9 months. I think at this point the true withdrawal is behind me and now I'm just dealing with real life anxiety and uncertainty. And there's so much of it that for the first time in my life it's manifesting with physical symptoms on top of mental and emotional. I'm considering trying an SSRI to help get back on my feet and regain a sense of confidence and stability or maybe just waiting until the world is more normal again to see if that in itself brings back a sense of peace. I guess at least I feel like I have options which is somewhat comforting

 

Anyway glad to hear the good news. Good luck with the baby! Please let us know when he arrives