182 replies to this topic

[fishinghat]

Well, stable for the last week. A rather constant low grungy feeling but not too bad. I am going to try the Lion's Mane Mushroom extract again and see if the stomach issues return. Started today at 500 g/day and if all goes well will move up to 500 mg twice a day in one week.

[invalidusername]

Grungy? Didn't know what that meant. I Googled... So, which one is it Hat??!

 

Definition of grungy

 

1: shabby or dirty in character or condition

2: characteristic of grunge music or fashion

[fishinghat]

That is interesting lol

Grungy is slang for feeling bad, not terrible, but bad.

I guess you would say shabby in condition would be the closest.

[gail]

Fishinghat, have you resumed the lorazepam as it used to be? Or have you continued a faster taper?

I need to tell you that I worry about this. When all goes well, why go searching for troubles as my dad used to say. That grunggy part, no me gusto!

[fishinghat]

I continue at that slightly faster pace. I would agree with you Gail but recent research says the longer you are on benzos the higher the risk of dementia so I am pressing it a little bit.

[ncmom]

Wondering if your cocktail could help my daughter taper more quickly.  She does not have a thyroid issue as far as we know, so based on my review of several recent posts, she could try any of the following:

 

Ashwaganda extract 

l-theanine (Suntheanine (pure l=theanine)variety)

N-acetylcysteine 

 

Meeting with her two psych docs next week for next steps and to shoot down the "rip the band aid" approach, so maybe we could suggest one or some of these?

[fishinghat]

Just personal opinion here but I think the ash... effect would be minimum on the Cymbalta withdrawal. Just not effective enough. The L-Theanine (sold as suntheanine) has been very helpful for many members and certainly is a shot. The N-acetylcysteine is used frequently to treat other withdrawals and poisonings and I would think it would be of some help to her as well.

[invalidusername]

Good grief - deja vu from the post in my thread here!! The exact cocktail.

 

I share your views on the ash - I have only used it previously to "take the edge off" and to relax muscles. It did have an effect, but at the height of withdrawal, it would be difficult to notice the effects unless it was a high dose of KSM-66, which while safe, will cost a small fortune!

 

But stacked with other things, there may be some benefit. This needs more looking into. 

 

There are a lot of "stacked" cocktails on the market, but they are not backed by any source of evidence... I mean 50mg of ash, 20mg rhodiola... what is such a small amount really going to do? They are that low a dose to avoid potential interactions. Nonetheless, it is an area that interests me more having gone through the last 4 months of my medicinal nightmare...

[fishinghat]

Well I have been dropping 0.67% every 3rd day. The day I do the drop I feel fairly uncomfortable but by day 3 I feel pretty good soooo I changed to dropping 0.22% every day. That comes out to be the same overall rate but it has eliminated my swings up and down, today I also have raised my ash from 1 per day to 2 per day. So far no stomach issues. If things go well I will raise to 3 per day next Friday. SO far I can not see a real difference with the ash in my system.

[invalidusername]

For the cost of the Ashwagandha that you got, it may very well be that you get what you pay for. As it is not standardized, there could be any level of concentration in them. It is like a hog-dog vendor saying the sausages are 100% pork... sure, but which bits!! 

 

KSM-66 is to ashwagandha, as suntheanine is to l-theanine. It uses the best bits! Before writing it off, I would suggest at least trying KSM-66 and stack it up with what you have.

[fishinghat]

You are correct I know. I did not expect one a day to do anything anyway so we will see what 2 a day does first and then 3. Should have paid closer attention.

[fishinghat]

Boy, am I an idiot. I wrote ash but I meant Lion's mane mushroom. I can't do the ash because of the thyroid issues. Sorry about that.

 

As my old daddy use to say... : Don't listen to what I say but listen to what I mean."  lol

[invalidusername]

"As my old daddy use to say... : Don't listen to what I say but listen to what I mean."

 

Like it

[gail]

Oh boy! I'm reading this very attentively then I get to the part where the ash is the lion!

Next step is the suntheanine, I will remind you my lost friend!

[fishinghat]

OK, on Feb 1st went to 2 a day on the Lion's Mane extract. This is the 3rd and I seem to be a little better. I will make my next batch of medicine tomorrow and will increase the drop rate a little more. So far no stomach issues.

[fishinghat]

Yes, the Lion's Mane extract is definitely helping. It has not only helped say 10% or so but is also making me a little sleepy. I have begun sllooowwwlly increasing the rate I am dropping on the Lorazepam to see where I will stabilize. I am currently doing a 0.28% drop a day which is around 5 times higher than when I started so I can truly say the Lion's Mane and NAC have helped.

[gail]

Fishinghat, that's a good review for lion's mane and NAC.

Increasing the rate sloooowly. Do you plan to let things as it is, meaning not adding anything else? Do you still feel the, agitation, can't remember the name you used? Thanks!

[fishinghat]

Agitation not present unless some unexpected stress appears. I am going to just follow what my bp indicates. It is still a little low so if that remains the same I will go up just a little bit more in my weaning speed. Once I get as far as I can with the Lion's Mane and the NAC then I will start to work with melatonin. As long as I go slowly things shouldn't get too bad.

[invalidusername]

Great news Hat... rooting for you this end.

 

So is this primarily for the anxiety symptoms... or something else/in addition?

 

And what dose/frequency are you working on presently?

[fishinghat]

I am going so slow I have very little symptoms. Mostly feel bad (grungy, lol) and a little agitation. Beginning rate was 0.17% a day and current rate is 0.83% a day. I had been weaning for a little over 4 years before I started on the supplements and started to increase my wean rate. During that 4+ years I was going slow enough to have no withdrawal symptoms at all and dropped from 6 mg/day to 1.3 mg/day.

Right now I am at 1.23 mg/day.

[invalidusername]

You truly are the living embodiment of you famous three words, Sir...

[fishinghat]

Lets talk about Lion's Mane Mushroom. There us a fair amount of research on its benefits including on depression and anxiety. Most studies use a combination of water and ethanol extract in their studies so I went with a high potency water extract using high heat preperation. It was also less expensive than many brands. I found no benefit the first week I used it (500 mg/day). The second week I went to 500 mg twice a day and within 24 hours started doing better. It has now been 8 days on the 2 capsules a day and I feel great. Mood very stable, dropping my lorazepam dose 50% faster than before with no withdrawal symptoms. My bp is low and a little lazy feeling, sluggish. All that indicates that I can probably increase my drop rate a little more. I will do that next week. Slow but steady. I have been very impressed with this so far.

https://www.amazon.c...e?ie=UTF8&psc=1
Full Spectrum Approx. 72% Polysaccharides
Contains 1,3-1,6 Beta Glucans (23%), Erinacines, Hericenones +more
One daily serving of our full-spectrum Lion’s Mane yields approx. 1,035mg of polysaccharides.

[KathyInFL]

https://www.amazon.c...e?ie=UTF8&psc=1
 

 

Hat, Which brand of Lion's Main did you get? This link you posted is generic.

[fishinghat]

Brain Forza Organic Lion's Mane Mushroom Capsules

When I click on the link it takes me right to the product. Don't you love technology?

It is American grown and made.

[KathyInFL]

Brain Forza Organic Lion's Mane Mushroom Capsules

When I click on the link it takes me right to the product. Don't you love technology?

It is American grown and made.

 

It takes me to a picture of the Brain Forza, but there is no purchasing button. When I click on "Purchasing Options" on the right, it takes me to various different brands that I can purchase. If I search for Brain Forza, I can click on a link to the product. It's $45.99 for 90 capsules, fairly more expensive than other brands on Amazon. Is is worth this price? I'm sure you have done your research, is Brain Forza better than say the brand Swanson?

[fishinghat]

This Brain Forza is much better than the Swanson's. The Swanson's is a dried whole mushroom and is not an abstract. Extracts are much more concentrated with the active ingredients than just the dry products. In addition, the Froza brand also contains the fruiting bodies and spores not just the mycelium. This produces a product much higher in the active ingredients. If you think this product is high you should have seen the original price one the first extract brand that came out. Over $100 per bottle.

This product is 72% polysaccharides which is the highest concentration on the market that I know of right now. It is not cultured on rice or wheat as a substrate and therefore is not diluted by these products. This brand is grown in a fermentation mix (water based) so the substrate does not contaminate the final product.

[invalidusername]

"When taken daily, organic Lions Mane mushroom may help support overall mood in older individuals."

 

Not saying anything

[invalidusername]

It sounds very much like the methods they use for Ashwagandha and the like. There are still those out there who will rip up the plant, throw it in a blender and put the result in a capsule. Not quite as simple as that!!

 

As Hat says, the "essence" has to be extracted... like hops for beer, malt for whiskey and so forth. And in much the same vein, this is why a Glen Fiddich will taste better than a CostCo - simply because of the still process in extracting the good stuff.

 

For proof, just look at Sean Connery - 88 years and still going! Maybe he could use some Lion's Mane Mushroom??

[KathyInFL]

"When taken daily, organic Lions Mane mushroom may help support overall mood in older individuals."

 

Not saying anything

 

I have socks that are older than you IUN so maybe it will work well for me! 

[fishinghat]

That is why it is so effective for me. It is about time that getting old has some benefit!!