2784 replies to this topic

[invalidusername]

I hate to jump in on this one, and I am never one to go against anything Hat has to say, however, from the research that I have carried out following my father's diagnosis of Parkinson's and speaking with the UCL where my father volunteers (UKPDC), I would say there is a very strong argument that my father's 20 years on AD's caused his condition.

 

But... you need to bear in mind his age when he was taking it, and the brains degradation of neuroplasticity capabilities.

 

At your age AJ, I would certainly say there is very little to be worried about. But I for sure wouldn't stay on them any longer than is needed. 

[fishinghat]

Good point IUN. I had forgotten the PD connection. Good catch.

[Axlejames]

What I am trying to pin point is my lack of being able to settle my thoughts and lack of trust in myself could that be because my brain needs to heal ? Feeding my doubts so much can that be attributed to my brain not functioning properly as I come off SSRI ?

[frog]

Axle I can't remember if you're still tapering or off Cymbalta completely, but fear was a huge component of the first months of my recovery. I didn't taper properly toward the end (jumped off completely around 18mg when i started seeing some withdrawal effects rear their head) I was actually doing relatively ok for the first 3 weeks and then (this is just my theory) I did a really challenging exercise class and I think it spiked my adrenaline. Since my body had no Cymbalta to control and my brain didn't fully have control yet either, I think it caused everything to go into an overblown crazy stress response while my brain and body figured out what the hell to do.

 

I think when your body is in major stress mode, the more rational parts of the brain take a backseat to the more primal survival stuff like anxiety and fear. I've been off Cymbalta for over 7 months at this point and I can say definitively that all my emotions felt EXTRA heightened during that time, especially fears and worries. It was like one scared thought would pop into my head and my brain would grab on to it and start ruminating on it endlessly until I felt completely hopeless. For me this mostly pertained to being scared of never getting better. 

 

At the time both FH and IUN kept saying that this emotional intensity fades and will pass. I trusted them but it was hard to believe while going through it. Everything feels very raw and intense during this phase. Well I can now speak from my own experience. This does get better. A lot better. I still have my days that feel very out of my control with emotions that make no sense. But they're much rarer and I can much better rationalize my way through them. Your brain will continue to get better with time. There's no doubt about that. 

[Axlejames]

Axle I can't remember if you're still tapering or off Cymbalta completely, but fear was a huge component of the first months of my recovery. I didn't taper properly toward the end (jumped off completely around 18mg when i started seeing some withdrawal effects rear their head) I was actually doing relatively ok for the first 3 weeks and then (this is just my theory) I did a really challenging exercise class and I think it spiked my adrenaline. Since my body had no Cymbalta to control and my brain didn't fully have control yet either, I think it caused everything to go into an overblown crazy stress response while my brain and body figured out what the hell to do.

 

I think when your body is in major stress mode, the more rational parts of the brain take a backseat to the more primal survival stuff like anxiety and fear. I've been off Cymbalta for over 7 months at this point and I can say definitively that all my emotions felt EXTRA heightened during that time, especially fears and worries. It was like one scared thought would pop into my head and my brain would grab on to it and start ruminating on it endlessly until I felt completely hopeless. For me this mostly pertained to being scared of never getting better. 

 

At the time both FH and IUN kept saying that this emotional intensity fades and will pass. I trusted them but it was hard to believe while going through it. Everything feels very raw and intense during this phase. Well I can now speak from my own experience. This does get better. A lot better. I still have my days that feel very out of my control with emotions that make no sense. But they're much rarer and I can much better rationalize my way through them. Your brain will continue to get better with time. There's no doubt about that. 

I have been off cymbalta for about 2 years they replaced it with zoloft I have been off Zoloft and Lamotragine for about 3 months I have been on SSRI though for about 8 years 

[fishinghat]

Snri or ssri, in either case these types of antidepressants effect the serotonin levels in the brain. More particularly the amygdala and hippocampus which are the centers for OCD, paranoia, fear as well as anxiety. These unstable serotonin levels cause us to become unsure of ourselves and second guess everything we do. As frog said. It will pass with time.

[Axlejames]

Snri or ssri, in either case these types of antidepressants effect the serotonin levels in the brain. More particularly the amygdala and hippocampus which are the centers for OCD, paranoia, fear as well as anxiety. These unstable serotonin levels cause us to become unsure of ourselves and second guess everything we do. As frog said. It will pass with time.

Awesome definetly answered my question thanks as always Fish and God bless

[invalidusername]

Frog that was a great response and a really good read.

 

"I think it caused everything to go into an overblown crazy stress response while my brain and body figured out what the hell to do."

 

I had a bit of a LOL moment to myself when I read that part, purely because it is so very true!

 

AJ - my theory is that more of the thinking and "so-called" rationalising passes over the to amygdala (the primitive "old brain") when chaos rules in the frontal lobe and prefrontal cortex which is responsible for emotional processing. 

 

Usually decisions are held back long enough for the front brain to make sense and rationalise your moods and decisions, but the old brain works so much quicker - so what happens is when we are anxious, we default these processes to the old brain which is primitavely fight or flight... whereas the front brain will say "woh - hang on a minute - lets have a think about this" and calms things down before jumping to conclusions.

 

I hope this makes sense. There are some great books which I think you would find useful. The Chimp Paradox is one that immediately springs to mind. 

[frog]

Totally agree with you IUN. I also found that (and still do to an extent) I struggled with any kind of decision making. I generally get a little stressed out about making choices because I tend to overthink things, but throughout the Cymbalta recovery I would IMMEDIATELY become insanely overwhelmed. Literally even when my husband would ask what kind of tea I wanted, I would get worked up...

[invalidusername]

Oh yes. Classic symptom. For me it was getting the last of the mayo out of the jar. 

 

Stupid silly things. 

[Axlejames]

Totally agree with you IUN. I also found that (and still do to an extent) I struggled with any kind of decision making. I generally get a little stressed out about making choices because I tend to overthink things, but throughout the Cymbalta recovery I would IMMEDIATELY become insanely overwhelmed. Literally even when my husband would ask what kind of tea I wanted, I would get worked up...

My issue is more of I will make a decision and tell myself I will stick to it. Make up my mind then Ill go back and recheck if that was the right decision over and over again. Like planting a seed and digging it up everyday to see if anything is growing yet. I do this a lot with the God and spirituality questions which  drives me insane constantly. I will say tho the longer I am off my meds and the more Time I give this the easier it has gotten to make up my mind and stick with it. 

[frog]

That's great! I think in your scenario (and it sounds like you're already doing this) there's also something to be said on trying to actively work on changing your own mental habits. In my opinion withdrawal mostly intensifies and amplifies our existing predispositions (with some exceptions for anxieties that get created as a direct result of battling the withdrawal for months on end). The brain loves to habituate, but fortunately it seems like the newer created thought patterns and habits are easiest to resolve, and of course the ones we've used for years or decades are the hardest. Research suggests it takes at least 2 months to form a new habit, potentially much longer if it's a more challenging habit. And breaking an old habit is very similar, because supposedly it's not possible to completely get rid of the neural response in our brain that corresponds to a particular habit. The key is to replace it with a better habit and then that neural connection becomes the stronger more dominant one and the old one basically gets put on the back burner. Fascinating stuff!

[Axlejames]

It has been 4 months off of Zoloft as of today. I have noticed improvements and basically trying to catch myself when I feel myself begin to tail spin. I am not 100 percent but I believe I am on the right path. 

[fishinghat]

What kind of symptoms are you having?

[Axlejames]

What kind of symptoms are you having?

Bouts of depressive episodes or lack of feeling anything, anxiety off and on but manageable. 

[fishinghat]

The reason I have asked is that as soon as my benzo is done I will be looking at weaning off my Zoloft. I have read dozens of forums that discuss peoples experiences and most do not mention depression or anxiety as much as they mention severe stomach issues. Thanks for the information. 

[Axlejames]

The reason I have asked is that as soon as my benzo is done I will be looking at weaning off my Zoloft. I have read dozens of forums that discuss peoples experiences and most do not mention depression or anxiety as much as they mention severe stomach issues. Thanks for the information. 

I apologize I was not as clear as far as side effect issues I am really not having any with the anxiety and depression those are things I recognize that are my doing ( I isolate and watch the news like a hawk) The side effects I had coming off was for about a week I felt drunk but it was like being carefree and woozy like light headiness it went away after a week. I had some diarrhea in the beginning as well but that went away. Hope this helps 

[fishinghat]

Thanks AJ.

[Axlejames]

I need help/advice. I recently decided to quit facebook I know that having it can cause anxiety and depression. I stopped about a week ago and at first I was anxious for a few days now I have fallen into a depression/numbness not sure if this could be because of that. I know that Facebook provides the illusion of socializing can it be that now that I am lacking that now I feel depressed and without real joy or emotion. Does this make sense? 

[fishinghat]

Both makes sense. Interfacing with people on any level is a stimulant. Whenever that stimulation is removed the body will often swing into the opposite direction, depression, until it stabilized. That is a common occurrence during withdrawals. After a period of anxiety it is often followed by a period of depression. No need to worry. Your body will adapt.

[invalidusername]

Agreed, it is a withdrawal just like Cymbalta was a withdrawal.

[Axlejames]

Been feeling quite numb this last week. Not sure what is going on with me a little back story I have worked 24 of the last 28 days straight could that be maybe burning me out? I also have been off social media for a little over a week. I am struggling here for sure but I keep acting like everything is OK but I am not so good on the inside. Any advice. 

 

Chris 

[fishinghat]

I would say that the 24 days out of 28 days is taking a toll. Your body needs rest, especially right now.

[Axlejames]

I would say that the 24 days out of 28 days is taking a toll. Your body needs rest, especially right now.

I think so to on top of the hours I also was doing a workout program on my lunch break I have a vacation coming up hopefully that will help. 

[invalidusername]

Bloody hell man... yes that is way too much - that is working 6 days a week for a month. Too much. I know I can be as guilty as the next person, but you need to be careful not to burn out.

 

How are you feeling about the lack of social media now it has been a few days?

[fishinghat]

I worked 80 to 95 hours a week for 5 years before my nervous breakdown. Phone calls all  night. Horrible. I paid the price. The longest stint I worked was 67 straight days starting up of a new production facility and the longest hours I ever worked was 37 during a major chemical spill. Oh I don't miss those days. Now you know why I have anxiety. I still can not stand to hear a phone ring.

[invalidusername]

That takes the prize for sure. Bless you Hat.

 

I remember during my earlier uni days, I had three part time jobs. If I wasn't in a lecture, I was either serving drinks at a pub, flipping burgers at a fast food chain, or clearing up spilt drinks and vomit at a night club. Days started at 8am and finished at 3am a lot of the time. No wonder I have a delayed sleep disorder!!

 

Truly amazing what the human body can put up with.

[Axlejames]

Bloody hell man... yes that is way too much - that is working 6 days a week for a month. Too much. I know I can be as guilty as the next person, but you need to be careful not to burn out.

 

How are you feeling about the lack of social media now it has been a few days?

The lack of social media is and has been difficult. I struggle with social anxiety in general so I dont really interact with a lot of people. I feel isolated now but I am getting better. I have basically told the place I work at that I am not going to keep putting my mental health at risk like this so we will see where that leads. 

[invalidusername]

Absolutely. Get in there before it is too late. Your employer needs to recognise that you are doing this for their benefit as well as your own.

[Axlejames]

I went on a family vacation this last week had a pretty good time. I had anxiety in the morning but by mid day it usually subsided. I decided to take a break from Adderall my Dr. said that if I wanted I could skip a day or two well its the beginning of day 2 and I am super irritable,anxious, somewhat manic has anyone had this happen if its manageable should I stick it out and do what I am trying to accomplish? Should I just take it it seems my brain is dependent on it now I am working on trying to get away from that type of thing for myself. Any advice?