24 replies to this topic

[christie]

I dont know if anyone might find this interesting. I have a friend in Australia that I have told about how Cymbalta got me sick. She just told me that cymbalta is banned in Australia because it got a woman sick to the point she was in the ICU for 3 weeks. Im wondering if other countries have banned it.

[luckysmom]

I am not surprised- It absolutely should be taken off the shelves, its a very dangerous drug; not to mention its already on the FDA's list for one of the 20 most dangerous drugs.

[christie]

What scares me is what the FDA told me when I spoke with them after my 2nd ER trip. That the drugs risks are worth the reward. me Im wondering how many people have to die

[ginnybean32]

Christie this is an excellent topic. One Ive already broached in another thread Ive written. I have seen on this board many people upset with Cymbalta for the side effects you go through on the drug and then the withdrawl you go through getting off it. I can relate to both and I have not been happy going through these terrible withdrawls or now having GERD (a stomach condition that can be caused by Cymbalta to deal with now that Im off Cymbalta anyway. My doctor was always upfront with side effects to look for when I first started Cymbalta and we have monitored my liver levels every 6 months just to be safe. I ended up getting GERD from taking Cymbalta for over 2 years but I also drink alcohol once in a while and I smoke ciggs, so the later 2 behaviours just kind of boosted my chances for getting it. My doctor caught it in time and the tests I had done only showed a little erosive espogitis which will be healed up by the 2 stomach meds I am now taking. So for me I feel like Im dodging a bullet although if I had to do it all over again. I have to say I would. Cymbalta saved my life. There is no question it did. And I would gladly go through even liver damage to take Cymbalta again if I ever might need to in the future.

I have also noticed on this board how your doctors are reporting little to no side effects when giving you all the drug to begin with and then when you want off they offer no help to make it as painless as possible. I find this disturbing and wonder what it would take to make more physicians research Cymbalta more thoroughly so they could educate their patients to the fullest so both doctor and patient can make an educated choice on prescribing Cymbalta. Just so everyone as you mentioned knows the benefits of taking it versus the side effects while on and then to go off Cymbalta.

I just see the doctors at blame here. Not Cymbalta. Even if you doctor dosnt say much about side effects you can easily ask your pharmacist what to expect while taking the drug. What reactions to look for ect. And if in some way he cant get all the information to you, you can always go to the Cymbalta drug site and then check the FDA warnings if there are any on their website. So even if you have a bad doctor there is no excuse not to know exactly what you are getting into when you take Cymbalta.

From what Ive read on this site it seems like it does the best with indiviuals who are in a severe or terminal depression. For me Cymbalta was my last option. They had tried every other anti depressant along with talk therapy and I only got worse.
I had found out my daughter who is almost 16 now had been being sexually abused by her father after our divorce. She was 7 when it started and she finally broke her silence when she turned 12 in 05. Im sure you can imagine I was a mess but I had just recently been in a car accident and was facing a major nerve surgery in Houston so for the mean time I did some counseling for myself my daughter and sons. All that keep me going and for a while I thought I was getting better. Then I tried working again as a nurse in 07 and I couldnt concentrate so I had to quit. My doc tried me on lexapro, zoloft, prozac, zyprexa and countless others that could not make the depression go away. I then really fell down hill in Sept07. I couldnt sleep, I didnt want to eat because to my mind at that time if I starved myself I would not feel so guilty about not knowing what was happening to my daughter. I lost a ton of weight. I got down to 118lbs and Im 5"10. I looked and felt very sick but I didnt care. I started having seizures from my anorexia and dehydration. I got to the point where my brain was telling me that I deserved this painful death of starvation. My husband finally convinced me to go to the hospital and I ended up staying a month. Cymbalta made me want to live again. Simple as that. So I had to say something. I mean its obviously not for everyone. All medicines dont always work the same in all people. I guess for me and my family when the doctor told us I could get liver damage, stomach problems some severe, withdrawl symptoms going off the medicine, I mean I stopped and paused but for me I knew I would die no question without a medicine like Cymbalta. Im not sure of what is happening to you specifically christie but my prayers are with you. Just know Cymbalta saved one persons life. Mine.

I think Cymbalta needs to be left alone. Its the physicians and pharmacists that need to take a step forward and make sure every patient is educated on the side effects and potential for withdrawl symptoms. They also need to provide blood testing every 3 to 6 months to watch the liver. Another note Id like to add is that in this day and age with the internet at your fingertips we can all leave our doctors with a new script for any kind of drug and if our doctor didnt explain the drug properly to you then you can always ask the pharmacist. If you still are feeling like you didnt get all the info you need to make your descion when you get home get on the internet and I guarnetee you will find every bit of information on it to make a descision whether you really want to take it or not. What Im trying to say is unfortunately in this day and age many of us have to advocate for ourselves in the choices we make for our own healthcare. Its too darn dangerous nowadays not too.

I really dont think it should be banned. I have not heard of deaths from it yet. I just firmly believe it needs to be prescribed in severe cases where the risks of side effects do not outweigh the benefits you can receive from Cymbalta.

[Houdi]

ginnybean32:

I agree with you that we should all take the ultimate responsibility for ourselves. I do feel that it is really hard for the average depressed patient to research a drug or therapy when they are in the throes of depression and pain. Especially BEFORE they have had an experience as bad as some forum members have had with MD prescriptions. (Hindsight is 20/20.) Being depressed can be all consuming as it is. I believe you understand that, as you are one that has walked in those shoes. And, some of us don't have pharmacists. We have to send our prescriptions into a mail pharmacy. So, we are hurting, depressed, overwhelmed, and just trying to keep ourselves together what we have left. We rely on the guidance of our MD. Shame on us? Maybe. I'm very educated, bright, logical, tech savvy, and can research just about anything. I didn't know this next anti-depressant (Cymbalta) was going to be such an issue for me.

Also, please remember, it is important for people here to voice their feelings without judgment. This forum helps the individuals that are having an issue with Cymbalta withdrawal. We're a support group. So, we all get a little mad, helps some of us get through. We feel bad. And we help each other with compassion. Please don't misunderstand my posting here. I think you are very supportive and compassionate and insightful. You are a treasure thread to this forum. So is everyone else, mad or hurt or ill or......

Houdi

[dneaks9624]

Christine,
Excellent info. we need to get this banned in this country, as well.
Diane

[luckysmom]

Houdi,
your an amazing person- I was feeling a bit... offended by a post, then read yours and gained some understanding. Right now I'm still not capable of thinking my feelings through before getting annoyed or upset and you really helped me to do that and have some "restraint of tongue and pen".

[itchy]

HI from Australia and Cymbalta is been given out as the new wonder drug!! Not sure where you got this information that it is banned.

I do believe there is a place for this drug to be used in extreme cases and with strict supervision. However, I was given it because I had insomnia and it did nothing but make me sick - I had nightmares started drinking alot and contemplated suicide. I agree on doing your own homework as I did but, we all have a stupid amount of trust in our Doctors when only about 10% of them deserve our trust.

[Houdi]

Hello itchy! I have never heard of Cymbalta being prescribed as a cure for insomnia, at least here in the states. Yes, I have heard of being itchy as a side effect of withdrawal. Actually had it myself, especially the one side of one soul of one foot. Still itches from time to time, but NOTHING like it used to. If you read some threads of forum posts, you will read about itchy 'weaners!' (With all due respect... :)

Have you tried a little Benadryl, an over the counter antihistamine medication here iin the US. I may help. I even tried the topical creme along with the pill form. Your brain is having fits from the lack of serotonin and it is sending your nervous system into overdrive. (That's at least my rendition of how I understand our predicament.)

Hope to hear from you soon....Houdi

[MaureenV]

Having just joined, I've just read this one. I'm also in Australia, and there was no mention of Cymbalta being under question here at any stage. Not to say it wasn't, just that I've heard nothing of that - yet! - and have just started on Cymbalta in the last few months.

Maureen.

[nursedeborah]

I am a nurse, and it' shte doctor's job to tell us the side effects of the druge we are going to take. They may not do so, but it is their job, they write the RX, so they are responsible!

Everyone is different, but in my short time here, just joined today, I see more negative things about Cymbalta than good. I can only go by what I have had to go through
while I have been on it. The clanging in my head if I miss a dose, or forget it if I miss 3 days worth, I become catatonic, and can't eat, sleep,or even drink water.

Had I known about all this I never would have gone on this drug. Someone said their brain amy them think something about what had happened to her daughter when she was little, and it wasn't her brain, but guilt, and shame. She also said the Cymbalta saved her life as did going inpatient. I am thrilled for her, but agian it does not work like that for alll of us.

Most I have seen are miseravle trying to get off this stuff, and I just nees help so bad with that. In fact that's all I came here for was help, even if it means getting this stuff off the market, a I do know that it's more dangerous, and that their are other meds that can help someone with depression.

Now I am getting into controversy, and I am sorrry, I am just living a hell because of this medication, and need all your support.
That's why we are here.

Peace, and joy,
Debbie

[libbyloo]

i was amazed to find this subject 'Banned in other Countries' and that Australia was one of them. interesting in that i was prescribed this drug at the end of August 2009. no warnings from dr, but the pharmacist asked me if i knew anything or if the dr had explained to me about this drug. the concern from pharmacist alarmed me slightly. what i have learned in the last week in which i have gone cold turkey absolutely flabberghasts me. gob smacked. shock horror. what the hell is the medical profession doing prescribing this to anyone has me beat! i look forward to seeing my doctor who has no idea i have gone cold turkey (in my 6th day) and telling him he is never to prescribe this insidious drug to anyone again. in the early stages i had suicidal idealisations and uncontrollable crying which scared the hell out of me. the dr encouraged me to remain on them. what the? anyway they are still prescribing it here in australia and if they are doing as a trial they are sadly mistaken if they dont think that they will have a law suit against them somewhere by someone. by the way i am doing ok. tummy pain today for a bit but gone, vertigo still the same but i look forward to the day soon hopefully that i feel completely free of this poison. lets make this world free of this cymbalta. i wish i had never heard the word but i certainly will never forget it.

[MaureenV]

libbyloo sounds like one of those friend of a friend of a friend stories.


There's no evidence on the internet (and it would be there somewhere) that Cymbalta was ever banned in Australia.

Unfortunately it's one of those anecdotal stories that gains truth as it gets retold.

The chances of it being banned are minimal, because it does have a use (diabetic neuropathy) for which it is excellent.

Even for that use, I would expect Eli Silly to provide information regarding the fact that withdrawal may/should take months, and for them to provide the wherewithall (5 & 10mg capsules) in order to do so. Fat chance.

While doctors have some patients who are doing extremely well on the drug (and diabetes is only going to become a bigger problem given obesity levels) they're not going to support the idea, understandably.

Just like Thalidomide was a good drug used for the wrong purpose, Cymbalta should not be used for depression.


regards, Maureen.

[nursedeborah]

Just started a petition to help get this off the market hope you all will sign it

http://www.ipetition... ... troyslives

Some of you are further along in your withdrawls, and when I read the post I was
put off by it. So I am just going to go along with Huodi, as she is always right on!

I just have never heard of it ever helping anyone, or anyone saying good things
about it. I guess because I am a victim of this noxious drug, and it took a few
years of my life from me, and now I get to go through the narly withdrawls.

I can't find anything good about it, nothing!

Debbie

[MaureenV]

Hi Debbie,

I could tell you weren't impressed - you weren't even able to talk to me about it, but had to refer to the post as though it came from outer space. I know from the posts we've shared and the support we've tried to give each other than you know I'm well intentioned, so I appreciate that you didn't give me too hard a time about it.


However ... if you look at it more closely, you'll find that where we agree is actually the majority of the information, and where we disagree is not so much about the drug, but how to go about resolving the nightmare it's causing at the moment.

I couldn't agree more that on the whole it's a nasty piece of work; from what I've read it would be rare for someone to take Cymbalta for depression or anxiety where there wasn't a better drug.

In my opinion there are executives at Eli Lilly for whom a public hanging would be too good a fate (and I'm opposed to capital punishment).

Where our paths diverge is how to go about it. I know you say you haven't heard anything good - well I have - but for one thing only, and that's Diabetic Neuropathy. Being a nurse I'm sure you know what it is and how painful and disabling it is for those with it. Unlike depression, if the drug helps deal with the pain IN A WAY IN WHICH NO OTHER DRUG CAN, they are unlikely to come off it.

Given that it has that one 'good' use, there's still the issue of withdrawal. It's totally and utterly unacceptable for Eli Lilly to stay mum about the withdrawal process for many (what those percentages are we've no idea ). You've said that 'some of us are further along' and I guess you mean me, but there you're suggesting that because I'm 'further along' it's not as relevant to me. Quite the opposite. I can't even drop from 10mgs to nothing without having to go back onto Cymbalta. I'm a perfect example of just HOW BAD this drug is when it comes to withdrawal. I've now dropped from 7.5 to 5mg, and still, STILL getting a recurrence of some of the symptoms, although thankfully milder. No one needs less convincing than me that the withdrawal information is appallingly negligent.

Therefore I would like to see Eli Lilly forced to give accurate guidelines for withdrawal based on real experiences: from the anecdotal things we read here, it sounds as though that may be something like 1mg withdrawal per day would be reasonable. (Not saying that's right for everybody, just that if you had to pick a figure, that sounds like it's vaguely realistic as INFORMATION COMING OUT FROM THE COMPANY. You don't seriously imagine any doctor's going to prescribe a drug which has this level of complexity for withdrawal?? Unless, UNLESS (like the other nasties, Thalidomide and that anti-acne one, whatever it's called) they're able to put in place protective measures for the people involved (as in tapered withdrawal).

Eli Lilly are not going to take this off the market unless they're forced to, and in order for that to happen it would probably have to be proved to be dangerous (as in more dangerous than other anti-d); that needs evidence; courts don't work on emotion, they work on facts.


Drugs can also be authorized for particular uses, and not for others, and I for one would be at the front of the march to support it being cancelled as an effective anti-depressant.

I'd also be at the head of the line calling for accurate guidelines on withdrawal.

so you see we actually MOSTLY agree - it's just how to achieve that objective where we differ.



:)))))))))))))))

Maureen.

-

[Junior]

Libbyloo

Cymbalta isn't the only anti-depressant that can bring on suicidal ideation and urges. They all can and I understand that many now carry a 'black box' warning. Apparently the 18-24 yr age group is the most susceptible, possibly because the frontal lobes of the brain aren't fully developed until at least 25. I also know that adolescent depression tends to manifest more as irritability rather than lowered mood.

I was on Aropax for over 10 years and it worked like a charm for me. Only switched because it didn't seem to be working as effectively as it had in the past. The one I switched to, Lexapro, eventually made me feel quite depressed and I had this urge to slit my wrists. And it was getting stronger. Because I felt low, it would have been very easy to have given in to the urge and I can now understand how, in clinical trials, healthy controls (people who have no mental health issues) have actually committed suicide. Thankfully I was aware that these drugs can have this effect and went straight to my GP.

The problem is, it's different for everyone. Many people have problems with Aropax whereas it worked beautifully for me. I have a g/f who is actually finding that Cymbalta is working well for her. I did warn her about the problematic withdrawal but she is intelligent and had already done her own research. I just hope she doesn't have the same problems that so many of us here have had.

Cheers
Junior

[Junior]

Maureen,

From what I have read at other forums, I believe that most drug companies (makers of SSRI's at least) recommend tapering at no GREATER than a 10% change at each drop. Having said that, there are people who come off (Aropax) Paxil at 1mg at a time (apparently they can get it in a liquid form) and even then some people can't handle it.

Regards
Junior

[MaureenV]

Maureen,

From what I have read at other forums, I believe that most drug companies (makers of SSRI's at least) recommend tapering at no GREATER than a 10% change at each drop. Having said that, there are people who come off (Aropax) Paxil at 1mg at a time (apparently they can get it in a liquid form) and even then some people can't handle it.

Regards
Junior

I'd love to know if my problems are combined Lexapro/Cymbalta withdrawals as I went straight from lexapro to C without so much as blinking at the difference (apart from the difference in side effects).

My GP is astounded (and will be even further astounded on Monday when I tell her I'm not completely off yet) given the short time I was on it.

Out of curiosity, I googled Lexapro withdrawals, and there are also heaps of sites for that where people comment on similar withdrawal symptoms.

~~~~~~~
This is a typical example from a Lexapro site: It is the toughest thing I have ever gone thru. Brain shivers, Insomnia, horrible vivid dreams, waves of nausea, headache, dry eyes, dizziness, zapping shock like feeling in my head and lips, sadness, feelings of unreality. Hang in there.
~~~~~~~~

After four days of 7.5mg I dropped to 5mg for six days (just because that's the way the 30mg divide easily) and if I've still got brain zaps on the last day (this is only the 3rd) then I'll just stay on 5mg until they go. They're only mild, and quite tolerable, but an indication that to drop any further may impact on my work.


Maureen.

[Junior]

Maureen,

It's hard to know. I tried to work all that out too and it's just too hard. Having said that, the wdl symptoms you described are much the same as what people trying to get off Aropax are going through. In my case I think it's SSRI's in general, but more likely Aropax as I was on it for over 10 years.

How long were you on Lexapro? Were you on any other SSRI before that?

Cheers
Junior

[MaureenV]

Hi Junior,


I was on Lexapro from November last year until about May this year. I also started HRT a week before the Lexapro (I had been putting all of my symptoms down to menopause).

Prior to that I had only been on anti-depressants once before, for about a year again, more than 20 years ago.

I know we've talked about the difference between things being depressing and being depressed, and you also know how frustrating it is to be told to get some fresh air, etc etc. Yes, yes, yes, we KNOW it all helps, but deep depression, as you know, is reaching the point where you stand at your wardrobe finding yourself unable to even work out what to put on, much less what to do with yourself.

I would never have committed suicide due to my daughter (esp after the mother of one of her classmates committed suicide violently, knowing the two kids would find her, and without leaving a note) however bad it got - but people do, so there must be worse places to be than I was at.

I had some horrible times in those 20 years (like most people's lives - s**t happens sometimes), and although I would get really down, I could manage to cheer myself up, or distract myself somehow. I suspect only those who've been there can truly understand the difference.

I think being (genuinely) depressed when there really not much bad happening in your life is even worse, because you have guilt added to the mix.

Anyways, I'm not opposed to ever going back on to an anti-d, but am ten times more wary than I would have been.

Knowing how it can be impossible to function normally when depressed, if I ever found myself heading that way again I'd be more likely to put in place stuff like getting a cleaner (so that the crap everywhere doesn't add to the mix); setting up an automatic appointment with the hairdresser (instead of doing as I did last year - dreading the 'conversations' that it involves and feeling even worse because my hair was yukky). etc etc.

I know when you ARE depressed it's too late to try to do these things - you'd have to do them when you felt vulnerable, so that they're in place. For those of us like me for whom some underlying depression is aggravated and made unbearable by actual stuff happening, it may make the difference.


long ramble, sorry. :))


Maureen.

[marron07]

I've been on 60mg Cymbalta for at least 6 years and have only discovered that it is a major problem now.It is currently unavailable in Australia (supposed to be temporary). I have also been on many different antidepressants over 30 years and found that Cymbalta had side effects that were tolerable for me. However, I'm very concerned about the possibility of liver damage and now need to come off them. I know that I will need support to do so. I've experienced the withdrawal symptoms before when coming off Paroxetine before going onto Effexor. I was completely unprepared for the experience and will find it much harder now at my age of 76. I would appreciate any tips on how to come off Cymbalta gradually without being able to access any lower strengths.

[gail]

Good morning Marron07,

Welcome to the forum, geez, I'm not sure that you should do this. Have you had a check up recently that would confirm this?

Many drugs are known to possibly cause liver damage. You have been on this drug for eight years and have been doing fine. And after being on antidepressants for 30 years, you will probably need another one.

Fishinghat will be in shortly, let's wait and see what his thoughts are. I believe that you are in beautiful Australia, I would love to visit there, I guess we would all love this.
So, stay tuned for Fishinghat's advice.

[fishinghat]

Hi Marron and welcome.

 

The manufacturers of Cymbalta and the generics recommend a liver function test every 6 mths when takin g Cymbalta as a precaution. I assume your dr has been doing this but in case he/she hasn't it would be the first step. In the back of my brain it seems like the liver damage was reversible if caught early enough but I may be mistaken. I will check this out for you and be back soon. I sure don't want to trust my memory.  lol

 

By the way, winter here. High 23F (-5C) and low of 0F (-18C). Suddenly I wish I was in Australia. lol

[fishinghat]

I have attached some research data with links below. As you can see it is a relatively uncommon event and usually occurs in the first few months of taking Cymbalta. It seems that if caught early it is usually reversible. Also note that according to FDA there have been NO reports of jaundice (yellow eyes and skin) after taking Cymbalta for 5 years or more. I think if you are still concerned then I would start with a liver function test from my dr. This is a simple blood test which measures the two primary liver enzymes. If you are still interested in getting off of the Cymbalta let us know and we will introduce you to a technique called bead counting that will help. We are here for you when ever you need us. Always glad to help.
 
Enjoy that Aussie sun for me.

 https://dailymed.nlm...esize=20&page=1

Drug insert for Cymbalta
Section - 5.2 Hepatotoxicity (Liver toxicity)
"These cases have presented as hepatitis with abdominal pain, hepatomegaly, and elevation of transaminase levels to more than twenty times the upper limit of normal with or without jaundice, reflecting a mixed or hepatocellular pattern of liver injury."
"In most patients, the median time to detection of the transaminase elevation was about two months."
Note - More details on liver issues at this site.

https://www.ncbi.nlm...les/PMC3773985/
"All 6 patients recovered without liver transplantation even though 3 had pre-existing chronic liver disease."
"Duloxetine hepatotoxicity developed within 2 months of drug intake and led to clinically significant liver injury."

https://www.ncbi.nlm...ubmed/17257478/
'In a pooled analysis of 17,615 subjects, the incidence of serum alanine aminotransferase (ALT) levels > 3 times the upper limit of normal (ULN), > 5 ULN, and > 10 ULN were 1%, 0.5%, and 0.2%, respectively.5 Almost all subjects maintained normal values of alkaline phosphatase and total bilirubin with no case of jaundice and hepatocellular injury (“Hy’s law”) reported.'
 
https://www.ncbi.nlm...ubmed/18690992/
'However, post-marketing surveillance identified 406 cases with potential hepatotoxicity from duloxetine between 8/2004 and 8/2006.6 Of these, 58 cases were considered clinically significant. A careful review of these cases led to the following observations: (a) there was no dose-dependent increase in the incidence of hepatic injury, ( a large number of cases occurred between 2 and 8 weeks of therapy and 74% with onset within 16 weeks, © 31% had either pre-existing liver disease or clinical risk factors for liver disease, and (d) there were two fatal cases possibly related to duloxetine.'

https://www.ehealthm...balta/jaundice/
FDA statistics on side effects
"95,293 people reported to have side effects when taking Cymbalta.
Among them, 299 people (0.31%) have Jaundice"
Time on Cymbalta when people have Jaundice *:
⦁ < 1 month: 32.17 %
⦁ 1 - 6 months: 44.35 %
⦁ 6 - 12 months: 5.22 %
⦁ 1 - 2 years: 5.22 %
⦁ 2 - 5 years: 13.04 %
⦁ 5 - 10 years: 0.0 %
⦁ 10+ years: 0.0 %

[gail]

Yeah! That's good news. 0% after five years. Marron, that should put you at ease.

Whatever you decide to do, we are with you.